Hello Sara Lewis:

I’m extremely happy that your eyes have been opened to see through the error of the Pre-Tribulation Rapture doctrine. I would strongly recommend that you also study through the rest of the verses in the more detailed bible studies at http://kjtruth.com/wp-includes/studies/PreTribulationRapture.htm and http://kjtruth.com/wp-includes/studies/PersecutionTribulation.htm.

I had some comments that I will try to keep as brief as possible given how many different doctrines are effected:

1.) First and foremost, we believe on the risen Jesus Christ as our Lord and Saviour who was called the Word of God for a reason (to show us that you cannot separate him from his word and that to attack his word is to attack him) and that we are saved by grace through faith in Jesus Christ (Ephesians 2:8-9). Secondly we stand on the King James as God’s perfect and infallible word in the English language for the English speaking people. We are convinced it is one of the most important doctrines for these last days and can effect the understanding of many prophecies and doctrines due to word changes in many of the so called versions. I say so called versions, because we are convinced that they are NOT another version of the word of God, but watered down and noticably corrupted fakes designed to dumb down Christians so that they will be caught unawares and weak when they are attacked. Put yourself in Satan’s shoes. Would you want to attack an enemy who has been eating watered down, corrupted milk and meat or one who eats pure and nutritionally healing whole foods? We are not Hebrew or Greek scholars, and have seen the dangers of people who pretend to be of that way. Instead we look for the knowledge and understanding of the word of God that can only come from God by his Holy Spirit as we prayerfully study his holy word. All references to scripture on this site will be from the King James.

* Look for more information to come on this extremely important topic.

2.) Amen regarding your statement that it is important to read ALL of 2nd Thessalonians chapter 2! I see TOO MANY people being willing to strain at v. 7 and 8 in order to say that they will be “raptured off the planet before the tribulation” and completely miss or ignore v. 1 through 4 that tell us plainly that there shall come a falling away FIRST and SECOND that man of sin (the antichrist) shall be revealed BEFORE the day the Lord when he comes to gather his saints. (“1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, 2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. 3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; 4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.”)

I cannot emphasize this enough! One has to be willing to strain at a gnat and swallow a camel to try to make “out of the way” in v. 7 and 8 mean raptured off the planet before the tribulation while ignoring v. 1 through 4 which plainly say that there will be a FALLING AWAY before the Lord returns to gather his saints. Notice those words, “falling away,” in verse 3 speak of Christians falling away from Jesus and the truth. It is the same in Hebrews 6:4-6 (“4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, 5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, 6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.”). This is clearly describing a Christian who gets born again and is enlightened, and tastes of the heavenly gift and are made partakers of the Holy Ghost and taste of the good word of God and the powers of the world to come, and after they sin and fall do not get up after they fall. Instead they choose to stay there with their faces back in the gutter in their vomit and their sin. That is the difference between falling and falling away. Everyone falls in one way or another. But one who falls away is one who does not choose to reach out their hand for the Lord’s help to get up by the Lord’s grace and strength and repentance.

So since there shall come a falling away first, according to 2nd Thessalonians 2:1-4, that would mean that there would have to be Christians who are in and of the truth here on earth when the son of perdition is revealed. Unfortunately for many of them, they shall fall away from the Lord, because they will choose to take the mark of the beast to save their lives and in doing so, they shall lose it. See Matthew 16:25, etc. Verses 1 through 4 are a warning to the saints that there shall come a falling away first before the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ when we are gathered together unto him. I think the main reason saints shall fall away from the Lord will be, because they were like the five foolish virgins of Matthew 25:1-13, who were not prepared to wait long enough for their Lord to come. The expectation of the pre-tribbers is that Jesus will come sooner than we think, “at any moment.” But the exhortation of Matthew 25 is that it will take LONGER than we think, so we had better be prepared to wait as long as it takes.

Furthermore, in order to get a pre-trib rapture out of v. 7 and 8, you have to incorrectly assume that “out of the way” means “off the planet” which it does not. It has never been necessary that God take his people off the planet to deliver them from his wrath or the wrath of Satan (some examples are Noah out of the flood; Lot out of Sodom and Gomorrah; Daniel in the lion’s den; Shadrach, Meshech, and Abednego in the fire; see the plagues of Exodus in Egypt and Numbers 16 for examples of how the Lord can plague his enemies while perfectly protecting his own from wrath). To presume that God must take us off the planet to protect us from his wrath, is to assume that God is a poor marksman using a big blunted sledge hammer and not a surgically sharp and precise sword even better than any surgeon uses a scalpel. In Numbers 16:31-34 “31 And it came to pass, as he had made an end of speaking all these words, that the ground clave asunder that was under them: 32: And the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed them up, and their houses, and all the men that appertained unto Korah, and all their goods. 33: They, and all that appertained to them, went down alive into the pit, and the earth closed upon them: and they perished from among the congregation.” We see perfect example of that surgical precision. Please note how that ONLY the enemies of the Lord perished along with all their stuff and no one else was harmed, because they were not appointed unto God’s wrath just as Christians are not. That is exacting, perfect precision!

The Lord has at times directed his wrath at some of his own people when they rebelled against him, (for example see Numbers 11:33, Number 16:46, Numbers 25:11). At no time in the past 6,000 years has the Lord ever had to remove his people off the planet in order to deliver them. Assuming he has to do that is a presumptuous and incorrect assumption, but it is necessary in order to manufacture a “proof” for a false pre-trib rapture.

The “mystery of iniquity,” Satan and his work in this world, has been at work long before the coming great tribulation that we, this generation, shall see. Some examples of the mystery of iniquity already being at work go as far back as Genesis 11 in the plain of Shinar while the tower of Babel was being built; in the garden of Eden when Satan was beguiling Eve and then Adam in Genesis 3 in order to become the god of this world, 1st Corinthians 4:3,4; and even before that while Satan (who was known as Lucifer before he left his first estate) was rebelling against the Lord in heaven. At that time he was called Lucifer and raised himself up in pridefully tried to exalt himself as God and talked a third of the angels of heaven into following him. See Isaiah 14:12-20, Ezekiel 28:11-19 , and Revelation 12:3-4;7-17.

Satan has many times, when given permission, been allowed to pour out his wrath and persecute the chosen people of God (i.e. over 400 years as slaves in Egypt, the millions and millions and millions of Christians and Jews who were tortured and murdered during the Spanish Inquisitions and the Catholic Crusades spread out over about 1,400 years; the millions of Jews tortured and killed by the servants of the pope in World War 2, and let’s not forget how they persecuted and murdered Jesus without a cause!). Since the servant is not above his lord, (Matthew 10:24 “The disciple is not above his master, nor the servant above his lord.”), this should come as no surprise to us. We are not to fear tribulation either, (Matthew 10:28-31 “28: And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell. 29 Are not two sparrows sold for a farthing? and one of them shall not fall on the ground without your Father. 30 But the very hairs of your head are all numbered. 31 Fear ye not therefore, ye are of more value than many sparrows.”). We should rather rejoice that we would be counted worthy to suffer for his name’s sake, (Acts 5:41 “And they departed from the presence of the council, rejoicing that they were counted worthy to suffer shame for his name.” and John 21:18,19 “18 Verily, verily, I say unto thee, When thou wast young, thou girdedst thyself, and walkedst whither thou wouldest: but when thou shalt be old, thou shalt stretch forth thy hands, and another shall gird thee, and carry thee whither thou wouldest not. 19 This spake he, signifying by what death he should glorify God…”). We should strive rather to be more like Stephen, (Acts 7:59,60 “59: And they stoned Stephen, calling upon God, and saying, Lord Jesus, receive my spirit. 60: And he kneeled down, and cried with a loud voice, Lord, lay not this sin to their charge. And when he had said this, he fell asleep.”) who followed Jesus’ perfect example, Luke 23:33,34 (“33 And when they were come to the place, which is called Calvary, there they crucified him, and the malefactors, one on the right hand, and the other on the left. 34: Then said Jesus, Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do…”).

3.) One thing I am gathering from your reply that you are reading the book of Revelation as a chronologically ordered book, that is reading Revelation as if the things that happen in chapter 16 happen later in time than the events of chapter 8. I am fairly certain that many of the same events are being described more than once. My understanding of the Book of Revelation’s events is that they are many of the same events told more than one time with different details attached and from different perspectives such as one from a heavenly view and another from an earthly view. I don’t have time or space here to try to discuss this, but simply wanted to encourage you to continue to study Revelation and Daniel and consider this.

I wish you well and I will pray that the Lord continue to open your eyes to his word.

Fare ye well.